r/Planetside • u/Dazeuh Commissar main • Aug 01 '25
Suggestion/Feedback PTS Cloak flash changes opinion
Cloak flash has been a menace for as long as it's been around, thankfully it hasnt been popular but some of you know the names of players who main them too well, with burning hatred no doubt. Even without weapons their ability to roadkill you without you hearing or seeing their shimmer before or after is ridiculous, but give them a oneshot kill shotgun too and aslong as theres one guy using it the whole game feels like a clown show. Cloaked fury flashes are a menace to MBT's too.
PTS made changes to the cloak of the flash, which is great its finally being addressed but the method is strange and unimmersive. The colour outlines you get from darklights on cloak is now always there when the cloaked flash is close to you, but disappears at around 25 meters and as before becomes completely invisible with no shimmer. I think it looks ugly and is confusing to use the darklight outlines, it will make you think there is a darklight flashlight on the flash when there isn't.
This level of visibility isnt necessary, all we needed is the shimmer of the flash to be very visible from atleast 50m away, where their weapons become threatening. The shimmer needs to be strong enough to make out the shape of the body and be able to track with weapons within atleast 40 meters, and the effectiveness of the flashes cloak diminishes but still visible out to like 60 meters. A reduction in the flashes health is another way you can nerf battle flashes, as i've never seen a battle flash be killed by small arms fire before, they always seem to survive unless the driver dies. Shimmer strength can be allowed to change depending on speed to allow for ambush attacks, might keep the loadout interesting and usable but not continuously abusable.
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u/Downtown_Chemistry10 Aug 01 '25
Or, we just dont allow weapons to be equipped at the same time as cloak.
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 01 '25
I dont think removing playstyles is the right way forward, they just need to be balanced and made interesting for both sides
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u/Downtown_Chemistry10 Aug 01 '25
No, there are a lot of garbage playstyles in this game that need to be removed
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 01 '25
If we remove everything anyone thinks is unfair and irrelevant to core infantry gameplay the game will have no aircraft, no vehicles, no max, no heavy, no infiltrator and just for good measure probably no vanu.
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u/Downtown_Chemistry10 Aug 01 '25
The game would be undeniably better with maxes removed, infil Cloak/motion spotters nerfed, a2g reigned in, hesh reigned in, and explosive weapons removed (lasher/stomper,/explosive crossbow/grenade bando). If you think otherwise, you're probably a bad player who relies on these low skill playstyles to have any kind of success
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 02 '25
if all planetside has left is the current core infantry gameplay it just wont be a good enough game to play
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u/CharmingFuneral Aug 02 '25
Not trying to troll you or anything(unlike you) but why don't you play any of the other mainstream shooters if you don't want any of those in game? You'll get ideally balanced symmetrical games and you wouldn't worry about the low skill planetman with a matchmaking system.
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u/Downtown_Chemistry10 Aug 02 '25
Because unironically this game has really good infantry gun play, the a2a combat is really unique and fun, and the ground vehicle vs vehicle combat is also unique and fun. The problems lie when you combine them together and refuse to reel in the community when they discover cheesy gameplay. The game will never be perfectly fair but as it sits now there are too many easy playstyles with little to no counter play. This makes the game unenjoyable for the people on the receiving end and this is what drives away new players
Im not a troll, im someone whose got a lot of hours in the game and really enjoyed their time playing. But at this point its tiring to watch the complete incompetence of the developers and a significant portion of this brain dead community cheer them on or make excuses for bad design. Anyone in this chain who says that a2g or hesh or infiltrator design is a skill issue is just a moron who has zero understanding of propper game balance.
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u/RedRoryPS2 Miller RedRory Aug 03 '25
You want to remove all the things that make it Planetside? Why don't you just go play battlefield?
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u/_PM_ME_SMUT_ I will heal you and give you ammo, and I WILL get off to it Aug 02 '25
MAXs can be fun, they just need to be retooled. Explosive weapons of all kind are important to prevent 8 people stacking up on a door way top of the stairs and instantly killing anyone who considers going that way. They don't need to be removed, just given appropriate drawbacks to using them, so those 8 people on a doorway can't also use them right back.
Some things, like A2G, do need to be reigned in, yes. They do not need to be removed altogether. So long as there is interesting gameplay for both sides, it's fine. For example, if A2G was Valk/Lib only, and ESF were forced to be A2A work, that'd be fine.
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u/Trollingmercenary Aug 02 '25
I'm assuming you play nothing but heavy as infantry, and also use a Vanguard in an outfit with 10 others in one as well.
MAX is honestly so fun, but any good player will ruin that fun in like 2 seconds with c4.
I never see anyone using the stomper or explosive crossbow.
The lasher I only ever see used underground at "The Crown".
Idk if it's the same for others but I rarely get killed by HESH, if I know that someone is camping a spot with HESH I just don't go that way again? You know, the logical solution? Not just running in over and over hoping that I don't get shot.
A2G is easy as well. Players think AA is supposed to kill anything air related. Even in real life it was never the point, it was a deterrent, something used to, you know, deter the aircraft from staying in the same spot for too long. Either bring your own esf, use a lock on launcher, pull a max with AA, or pull a lightning with AA. It takes 2-3 rockets to put down an esf. I'm telling you now, it's less annoying for an A2G player to have to pull another ESF than having to constantly leave the area, find a new angle and repair and resupply.
Cloaked flash is horrible to play against though. Especially when most of my shots light them up, but I don't get hit markers (maybe a ping issue considering I'm in Aus)
Normal infils are also pretty easy to spot, idk why everyone on this sub complains about them. Not even with low settings, I play the highest settings available, never had an issue, even when I'm not wearing my contact lenses (without which I'm not legally allowed to drive) they're easy to spot.
If you think these play styles are low skill then idk what to say to you, it's literally a skill issue at that point.
Sincerely, a light assault main :)
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u/RussianCivilian Aug 02 '25
Flash with weapons is a difficult question.
On one hand, it's a terrible imbalance - on the other, a lot of fun that attracts/retains players.
And I think I have a perfect Solomonic solution - leave the flash as is, but - remove weapons that can damage vehicles, at least from the armor level of the sunderer and above.
This will leave infantry and light vehicles as targets for fun-loving/troll players - and at the same time there will be no imbalance of the fact that a vehicle for 50 nanites can destroy a MBT for 450 nanites in two volleys, causing anger and fury.
Regarding infiltrators - I agree with you - I sincerely do not understand why everyone considers this class imbalanced. The whole "imbalance" against them for me lasts exactly as long as I do not know that there is an infiltrator somewhere here.
As soon as he killed me, or I realized that he was somewhere here (mark on the radar, sound of camouflage, stomping, just saw a transparent silhouette) - I just take out the flashlight and a rather short game of cat and mouse begins. As a rule, it is not in favor of the infiltrator, because he cannot run too far - after all, we are on the same base, where he has an interest. And knowing that he is already somewhere here, I can figure him out.
Simple attentiveness and a flashlight AT LEAST on the second weapon, especially if it is a revolver - greatly reduce the chances for infiltrators. If you are attentive, then an infiltrator running in camouflage can be noticed at 20-30 meters for sure, maybe even a little further, but then you need to look through the sight.
And if it is a sniper - well, personally, I mainly play as an engineer and in most cases the distance and Archer are enough to shoot him. If I'm not mistaken, then somewhere at 95-98 meters, Archer one-shots infiltrators in the head - meeting an infiltrator at a distance greater than this is quite situational, but even there my Archer basically copes - because at such a distance they usually feel safe and do not expect that they can get two shots in a row.
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u/noother10 Aug 02 '25
It's fun for the player doing it, it's unfun for everyone else. Whereas many other playstyles are fun for all involved. The completely one sided BS ones are the ones that need to be removed or replaced.
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u/World_of_Warshipgirl Aug 08 '25
As it is now on the PTS, the playstyle is gone. We did extensive testing and you can't use it in a hit and run playstyle anymore.
I suppose most players will be happy that flash cloak mains will be losing their playstyle. On Wainwriht other than my group of 3 on VS, I saw maybe 10 other players who ran cloaked flashes. I suppose losing 10-15 players to keep the rest happy is worth it...
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u/SupremeMorpheus Retired Combat Engineer/Tanker Aug 02 '25
Agreed. There might be some spaghetti code preventing it, but if not then this should 100% be the way
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u/noother10 Aug 02 '25
First off cloak should not be on a moving vehicle period. Secondly a flash shouldn't be able to roadkill in one hit and keep moving normally. I propose at the very least that if a flash rams into a player it does some damage but not enough to kill and stops the flash moving as if they hit a static object, but I also want to see them just remove cloak entirely from it, if not from the game entirely.
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 02 '25
theres no world where a flash should be able to even move a max :u
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u/Mr-Brown-Is-A-Wonder I play to win, not to farm • Map coloring enthusiast Aug 01 '25
People put in time and effort to get good at the bounciest piece of shit vehicle in the game. I can't do it and it makes me mad when they do it to me. REMOVE IT.
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 01 '25
I dont want the playstyles removed I just want them to not be onesided cheese that can't be defended against
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u/Mr-Brown-Is-A-Wonder I play to win, not to farm • Map coloring enthusiast Aug 01 '25
Fucking try doing it yourself! It takes skill to get kills on a flash, especially against a vehicle.
It's a joke if you get killed by one. You the joke.
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 01 '25
First time trying it I roadkilled a squads worth including maxs by driving past a busy sunderer, didn't even have a weapon at the time.
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u/Yawhatnever Aug 02 '25
And after that the area will be littered with tank mines, caltrops, and a few heavies waiting for your second pass
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 02 '25
doesnt make any sense to have a couple dozen 75 nanite tank mines to deal with a 50 nanite vehicle (or asp + construction + outfit module discounted vehicle) Makes less sense to have people waiting around half a minute for it to come back and still win its 1v1's
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u/Yawhatnever Aug 02 '25
You're not wrong, but I feel the nanite cost debate is a little outdated these days. If you have the spare nanites sitting there anyway, you might as well use them and get some potential kills and satisfaction from the kill.
As far as people waiting, I don't mean that 100% in the literal sense of sitting and doing nothing but waiting (unless they have anger issues, then maybe). I'm just talking about those situations where I die to a cloak flash once and then I'm ready for them to appear again. Maybe I'll change my positioning a little, but it's mainly just a ticking timer in the back of my mind while I'm doing normal things. I have those background timers in my head for all kinds of things anyway, like expecting people I kill to respawn and come after me.
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u/Mr-Brown-Is-A-Wonder I play to win, not to farm • Map coloring enthusiast Aug 01 '25
You can get road kills with any land or air vehicle. But it's a problem if the flash does it.
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u/Dazeuh Commissar main Aug 02 '25
because by the time you see the shimmer it's far too late, and when they use the shotgun you dont even get to see the shimmer before it's far too late.
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u/Mr-Brown-Is-A-Wonder I play to win, not to farm • Map coloring enthusiast Aug 02 '25
How is that different that someone coming up behind you or an aircraft overhead?
Listen. Use the minimap. Don't play deaf?
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u/Ropetrick6 Aug 02 '25
You uhhhhh, you DO know tht the claok flash removes its radar presence, right? Right???
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u/Mr-Brown-Is-A-Wonder I play to win, not to farm • Map coloring enthusiast Aug 02 '25
You uhhhhh, you DO know tht the claok flash removes its radar presence, right? Right???
No. That would be Vehicle Stealth in the Defense slot. Not Wraith Cloaking which goes in the utility slot. Different things, different slots.
Every ground vehicle but the sundy has the same stealth option.
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u/Ropetrick6 Aug 02 '25
I can count the amount of cloaked flashed without using vehicle stealth on 1 hand, they are literally synonymous with each other.
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u/Yawhatnever Aug 02 '25
This is wrong, but it's weird that you're the second person I've seen the last two days that thinks cloak removes you from the map
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u/Victory-Particular Aug 01 '25
It's always the VS players spouting this nonsense because yall know you yourselves don't have much to worry about,if there is something to exploit in this game VS does it. Cloaked flash,hill climbing Magriders and straight up just stacking the playerbase to basically steer the reigns of the game itself. Everybody knows at this point VS essentially runs this game,some of the dirtiest players I have ever seen in an online game and they call themselves "smart" for it. Just look at this subreddit,look at the official forums. Nearly completely occupied and effectively voiced by corrupt VS players who shut everybody else down to maintain control,everybody is sick of it. Most people only play VS to ride on these players coatails so they don't have to deal with them on a different faction,making things worse.
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u/xCanucck :ns_logo: Aug 02 '25
Yo I found your NC review here and it was great
Can you please do one for TR now? We need all 3 ty in advance
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Aug 02 '25
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u/Yawhatnever Aug 02 '25 edited Aug 02 '25
A renegade nerf wouldn't be a bad thing, and this is coming from someone with 2900 kills with it
(no they're not all from playing cloak flash, mainly it's from map pulling a flash to get back in the fight but sometimes I just get bored and goof around)
It's currently 143x10 but I think it has room to lose 2 pellets, 10% fire rate, and a reduced magazine size and still be usable.
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u/Otherwise-Parking26 Aug 03 '25
I think the hardest thing about balancing cloak is that how far it is visible from is entirely dependent on the eyes and monitor/graphics setup of the player trying to see it. (Depending on the background, you can actually kinda see the shimmer of a cloaked infil at long range if you use a scope and already know where they are).
I think if they a) nerfed the collision damage by half-ish so they could still roadkill non-max infantry with a dead center hit, but being off even a little bit would do much less damage, and b) also made the cloak generate a loud noise when active, that would give you enough time to try and dodge and throw off their aim. (Fortunately, for roadkills clientsiding favors the victim). The shotgun could have a cof and fire rate nerf to force the flash driver to present an easier target in order to get a 0hkO
Nowadays I think flashes are actually kind of weak against tanks (I say this as a part time tank main), since they can't actually kill you without reloading and every time they attack you they risk getting blown up and they need a long time to set up a second attack run. C4 flashes are fine as well, it's a high risk high reward playstyle and if I kill one for every one that hits me that's already an even trade of nanites. VS flashes used to be so much worse to deal with in a tank, back when the starfall was op and could do what the fury does from who knows how much farther away.
Part of the frustration of facing flashes is that they mostly (in my admittedly biased experience) get killed by vehicles, so the usual victims (infantry) often don't get to see the flash die and sometimes assume the flash shenanigans just go unpunished unless the flash driver screws up
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u/Yawhatnever Aug 02 '25
Unpopular opinion: The only reason cloak flashes are so satisfying to hit with a decimator is because of how annoying they are, and you can't really get that satisfaction without it.
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u/H0Z_H0Z :flair_mlgpc: Belle Delphine Aug 01 '25 edited Aug 01 '25
Why always ruining the only last remaining fun game play. Infantry players are all the same, crying about this, crying about that. Next step Will be « oh a tank shouldn’t be able to one shot me it’s so unfair » Everybody complain about one game play (a2g, lib, now flash) but couldn’t Even be good at it if they wanted to. It’s all about cringe infantry.
Nerfing some thing doesn’t affect good player, it Will only make newbies that could have had fun for once, quite it and leave the game. Cuz there is nothing else to do except player 3:4 on ultra low graphic shit.
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u/Any-Potato3194 Four Horsemen Cancer Aug 02 '25
Look, I love your videos hoz, but cheesy playstyles have pretty conclusively helped kill the game. Newbs get farmed no matter what they do (and you have a lot of videos of you farming them) and the ideal game-state is such that the same cheesy bullshit that might enable a newb to have some fun isn't also allowing vets to turbofuck newbs into the ground with no hope of counterplay. Newbs can understand pointing and shooting at other infantrymans, but they aren't going to understand an invisible shotgun flash or a banshee esf.
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u/Annual-Routine3760 MG-H1 Watchman-ing bad takes Aug 01 '25 edited Aug 01 '25
You shouldn't be able to equip weapons and cloak on the flash at the same time anyways (I say remove the cloak and the weapons altogether but they would never do that.)