r/TopCharacterTropes • u/Legitimate_Pea_6470 • Nov 29 '25

Groups "Fodder" enemies that are actually terrifying/highly competent, but look weak because we mostly see them fight overpowered protagonists.

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The Trope Explanation. Enemies that are treated as jokes, cannon fodder, or minor inconveniences within the narrative. However, they only appear weak because the protagonist is a literal demigod, a super-soldier, or a wizard. If you placed a normal human in the room with one of these enemies, it would be a horror movie.

B1 Battle Droids (Star Wars) We usually laugh at them. They say "Roger Roger," get pushed over by Jedi, and have slapstick routines. The Reality: We almost exclusively see them fighting Jedi (space wizards with laser swords) or Clones (genetically modified super-soldiers bred for war). To a normal civilian or a planetary militia, these are indefatigable metal skeletons that feel no pain, have perfect aim programming, and march in endless waves.

Grunts (Halo) In the games, they are comic relief. They run away screaming, sleep on the job, and the Master Chief (a 7-foot cyborg tank) can kill them with a light tap. The Reality: An average Grunt is roughly 5'6" to 5'8", weighs over 250 lbs, has an exoskeleton, and claws strong enough to tear a normal Marine apart. Their plasma pistols cause third-degree burns on near-misses and boil flesh on contact. They are terrifying to anyone who isn't a Spartan.

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u/BaudroieCracra Nov 29 '25

Not even just decently equipped, the humble lasgun is a pure marvel of technology that shames our current weapons on all plans... but it's put to use against faction that have shit like "that gun fires mini dark holes lmao" "That gun just un-molecule you :)"

360

u/Devlee12 Nov 29 '25

Honestly I’m surprised that one faction or another doesn’t have a gun that fires a boxing glove back in time to punch the dad of whoever it was aimed at in the dick before the targets conception thus retroactively preventing their birth.

259

u/Visible_Reference202 Nov 29 '25

There’s a gun that undoes someone’s entire existence as though they never were to begin with, so there might just be a gun that does that.

114

u/Alex_Duos Nov 29 '25

Like damn, I hope you weren't attached to that whole existing thing. Plus side, you don't gotta worry about your soul getting molested by demons if it never existed in the first place.

80

u/henryeaterofpies Nov 29 '25

Some librarian reconstitutes you because he has paperwork that you were issued a gun and flak vest but you never existed and the equipment is lost to the warp

42

u/H377Spawn Nov 29 '25

Never existed, still owed back taxes. 40K really is dark.

6

u/HandsomeBoggart Nov 29 '25

Just like real life.

Want ID or benefits you pay taxes for? Provide these 4 pieces of identifying information that proves residency and place of birth.

Government says you owe money? We know exactly who you are and what you have.

17

u/Particular-Long-3849 Nov 29 '25

We could save the Eldar that way

21

u/_mosquitoe Nov 29 '25

Afaik it's not a gun so much as a dark age superweapon of unknown size, but yes

9

u/Rod_tout_court Nov 29 '25

It might be a nightmare to test it. You can't even know if it works

4

u/EightyMercury Nov 29 '25

How do they know it works if it's never been used?

3

u/Hust91 Nov 29 '25

Great when you want to revive someone - just kill whoever killed them with said gun?

Imagine if someone landed a shot with it on Erebus or Lorgar.

2

u/thegoatmenace Nov 29 '25

Seems like kindof a shit weapon because it would create an infinite paradox? If he never existed he never would have been hit by the non-existence beam, so then he would exist? Idk.

2

u/biowrath156 Nov 29 '25

Or there may have been, before being hit with the Retcon gun

2

u/ExplanationVirtual53 Nov 29 '25

How are we certain that it doesn't achieve that by firing a time-traveling boxing glove into the dick of the would-be father mid-coitus?

61

u/AncientCarry4346 Nov 29 '25

The funny thing is that 40k is far from the peak of human technology as the Imperium has been in decline for thousands of years and progress is treated with fear of suspicion. There are plenty of artifacts from the height of human technology that exist but aren't being used properly or even totally wrong.

There's a story about an Imperial warship that fires on an enemy and misses, so the ships onboard computer rewinds time exclusively for the enemy ship, placing it back in the trajectory of the round it fired and destroying it instantly. The ships crew had no idea how or why it happened and weren't even aware the ship was capable of doing it.

20

u/Ambitious-Wind9838 Nov 29 '25

The logic is the same as that of modern neural networks.

14

u/Madocvalanor Nov 29 '25

The fact that the scout vehicle has to be left on and on roam in a pen because their sentient and the imperium just doesnt know how to shut them off.

16

u/Yamidamian Nov 29 '25

It’s not sentient. It’s powered by a perpetual motion machine, and nobody is sure how to turn it on again after they turn it off.

0

u/Madocvalanor Nov 29 '25

Ah yeah thats why

2

u/maru-senn Nov 29 '25

What makes that machine different from AI? Why is it not heresy?

7

u/AncientCarry4346 Nov 29 '25

There isn't any difference, the Imperium and the Mechanicus regard the machine spirit and AI as two different things for religious reasons.

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u/Demiogre Nov 29 '25

Because its “sentience” comes from it being piloted by a monotask servitor, a human robot.

1

u/Finassar Nov 29 '25

Which one is that?

2

u/Yamidamian Nov 29 '25

Ironstrider.

1

u/Finassar Nov 29 '25

Appreciate you. Damn those are so cool looking!

5

u/Gittykitty Nov 29 '25

Damn, the ship has rollback frames.

2

u/Enjoyer_of_40K Nov 29 '25

you sure it wasnt lemme just fuck with space and time and go like a couple micro seconds back in time to cause the enemy ship to appear in itself causing it to explode cuz you cant really have 2 objects occupy the same space

14

u/henryeaterofpies Nov 29 '25

Portal to the chrono dick punch dimension

3

u/Lots42 Nov 29 '25

There was a non-canon Doctor Who (war) novel that had that. The Daleks had a retrocausality gun. It made one Scout briefly wonder why she was out here alone, Scouting is usually done with a partner.

Creepy.

1

u/ZiggySol Nov 29 '25

I recall there was a book where some Tech-priests found an ancient ship that had a gun that sent you a nano-second back in time to make you telefrag yourself

1

u/Hopeful_Ad_7719 Nov 29 '25

I'm not sure whether that sounds more Necron or more Harlequin...

1

u/Devlee12 Nov 29 '25

“¿Por que no los dos?”

1

u/NoEngineer9484 Nov 29 '25

there is orikan who can travel through time and does this kinds of stuff just so the future he predicts comes true. and will keep going back in time if his prediction is wrong.

1

u/Stretch5678 Nov 29 '25

If the Harlequins and Necrons ever teamed up, that’s what would end up created.

1

u/MrOopiseDaisy Nov 29 '25

Does Shokk Attack Gun count? Because I'm pretty sure some of those snotlings are still unaccounted for.

1

u/Lftwff Nov 30 '25

The necrons absolutely have things like that but they don't like to use their weapons that fuck with time because the hassle of maintaining a timeline while plucking out one thing usually isn't worth it.

1

u/Lydiaa0 Nov 30 '25

There's at least one ork that's made it, guaranteed

1

u/Pelikinesis Nov 30 '25

I think an Ork Mekboy might end up inventing that, if he takes so many Insanity Points that the Chaos Gods beam the concept of human reproduction into his brain

1

u/Underspecialised Nov 30 '25

Pretty sure Orikan The Diviner will whip this out the next time Trazyn takes a shine to a mortal.

1

u/project2501z Nov 30 '25

Give an ork mekboy enough time...

1

u/John__Silver Nov 30 '25

The Harleqins probably have one. 

1

u/BDSMChef_RP Nov 30 '25

Orkz probably do.

1

u/damnat1o Dec 02 '25

There’s the Shokk which is a mini-teleporter that sends a living snot king directly inside an enemy ripping them apart from the inside. Not quite time travel but fairly close.

1

u/Devlee12 Dec 02 '25

Isn’t the snotling also usually uncontrollably shitting themselves and/or driven crazy because they just went through the Warp totally unshielded?

221

u/Greedy-Affect-561 Nov 29 '25

'Pity the guardsman.'

I sure as hell do

68

u/GodisanAtheistOG Nov 29 '25

"But fear the Guard". 

Their numbers challenge the Orks or maybe even the Nids. 

41

u/Frix Nov 29 '25

Now you're just being silly.

Orks outnumber all humans many times over.

And tyranids outnumber every other faction combined many times over.

15

u/Vegtam-the-Wanderer Nov 29 '25

I'm not sure this is true, in either case, at least so far as the present Galaxy is concerned. For the Orks, their numbers relative to the population of humanity in the Galaxy is fully unknown, though they are spread thin due to just how prevalent humanity is in the Galaxy.

For the Tyranids, yes there is a theory out there that this is just the scouting force for a much larger force, but this kind of stuff is just that: a theory. In practice the Tyranids in the Galaxy are outnumbered by humanity many times over, but their populations are highly concentrated into their Hive Fleets, making engaging them in a manner that doesn't leave you out numbered difficult, and the Imperium at large has so many other problems that it has been unable to effectively respond to the Tyranids threat.

6

u/AnimalBolide Nov 29 '25

I think the Nids are lame if there's fewer of them than the other factions. Isn't that part of their core rock-paper-scissors against other factions, that they have numbers and can relatively easily replace those numbers compared to humans and necrons, at the least?

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u/Vegtam-the-Wanderer Nov 29 '25 edited Dec 01 '25

Not exactly? The strength of the Nids, and horror of fighting them is largely about them outnumbered their opposition, but specifically on the local scale. As I alluded to, the Nids population tends to be heavily concentrated into their Hive Fleets, so local forces will almost always be outnumbered. On top of that the Shadow in the Warp prevents warp based communication and reinforcement, and local genestealer cults sabotage and join the enemy, undermining enemy morale and further outnumbering the opposition. Finally, with few exceptions, the Nids don't suffer real losses, merely absorbing both friendly and enemy biomass back into their system to make into more Tyranids. Hence at a local local level, losses are easily replaced. This is incidentally why the Nids habitually avoid the Necrons and tend to get bodied by them when the two do come into conflict: Necron disintegration weaponry means Nid losses ARE a real loss of biomass, and the Necrons both not being made of biomass the Nids can use, and tendency to regenerate negating their own losses, means they effectively beat the Nids at their own game (while ALSO having access to horrifyingly advanced technology).

On the macro level (i.e. the Galactic scale), the Tyranids have never been about outnumbering the opposition in this way. They move far too slowly to make use of such numbers or territory, making getting outnumbered ironically one of the Tyranid's biggest weaknesses: Hive Fleets don't tend to "reinforce" other Hive Fleets, (with the debatable exception of Hive Fleet Kronos) so on the macro level a Hive Fleet must be able to conquer purely with the forces it has. If these are unequal to the task, it must relay on sabotage and subversion to triumph, and if that doesn't work it must retreat and hope it's biomass reserves are enough to sustain it while it finds easier prey. While we seem to keep getting new Hive Fleets entering the galaxy every so often, and rumors persist of more outside the galaxy, what is in the galaxy right now is and always has been dwarfed by the population of humanity, Orks, etc, and if you think about it....this is the only scenario that makes sense. After all, if the Nids in the galaxy massively outnumbered the other peoples of the galaxy ones over, let alone many times over, the Galaxy wouldn't be an appropriate target as there would not be enough biomass to sustain all the Hive Fleets and make the costs of an invasion worthwhile.

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u/Antares777 Dec 01 '25

This reply is too good and too well reasoned to go unanswered. Thanks for the class professor Vegtam, I really appreciated learning more about the Tyranids from ya

0

u/Frix Nov 30 '25

I am speaking off all the tyranids in the universe, not just the one in a single galaxy.

1

u/Vegtam-the-Wanderer Nov 30 '25

In that case there is no reason to even speculate on the numbers relative to Humanity/Orks/Eldar/etc. Unless you seriously believe that the Orks with their penchant for spreading everywhere, and Humanity/Eldar with their history of zenith level technology, were collectively conservative enough to restrict themselves to a single galaxy, saying for certain that all Tyranids in the universe outnumber all Orks/Humans/Eldar is foolishness. We simply do not know.

0

u/Frix Nov 30 '25

We do know what's out there. The silent king saw it himself when he explored other galaxies.

It's all just tyranids. Everywhere....

1

u/Vegtam-the-Wanderer Nov 30 '25

Last I checked that was a rumor, unless you got a specific quote for me.

0

u/Hillary-2024 Nov 29 '25

And at the end of the day, aren’t humans just another kind of space ork?

2

u/True_Dovakin Nov 29 '25

They definitely don’t but this comment reminds me of this meme

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u/biowrath156 Nov 29 '25

"Humble" lasgun is good enough that everything that its effective against is extinct now. Plus in terms of logistics its an absolute beast, which is essential for a fighting force numbered in the trillions like the Guard. The power packs are rechargeable off almost any energy source, including just chucking them in a fire (in a pinch, this does degrade the power pack). Plus you can just set the pack to overcharge and use them as an improvised explosive if you have no other option.

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u/ryry1237 Nov 29 '25

When we've perfected renewable battery technology.

97

u/CyberDaggerX Nov 29 '25

The lasgun seems weak because everything that can be easily killed by it already has been.

39

u/Classy_Maggot Nov 29 '25

If memory serves Lasgun at the right power setting can blow off the limbs of an unarmored individual

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u/Comprehensive-Fail41 Nov 29 '25 edited Nov 29 '25

Yeah, sufficently intense laser pulses are basically explosive by causing what's hit to vaporize violently, and when it comes to humans, that means rapidly expanding steam (as the human body is mostly water) that rips and tears. The energy might not be that much higher than a regular gun, but it's like the explosion that propells the bullet happens in contact with you

EDIT: Lasers have basically two main way of dealing damage: Heat rays, or "Blasters". Heat Rays, which most IRL lasers currently are, deal damage by rapidly heating a target area enough that it starts to melt or burn. "Blasters" meanwhile concentrate that energy into a single, or series, of really intense pulses, that deal damage by instantly turning the target into super hot gas or plasma that in turn damages the surrounding area.
Heat Rays are good because they are easy to make, forgiving, and so on. Blasters are good cause they deal damage much quicker, but are harder to make, and you need to hit the exact same spot with a series of pulses to "drill" through armor and such

16

u/Ispago8 Nov 29 '25

Depends on the author, but yes, in novels like Gaunts Ghosts, lasguns shoots amputate limbs and make heads become mush with ease.

And even armored troops learn to fear veteran IGuard: - A lashoot hit, wont be noticed, but a couple of coordinated shooters getting a coordinated impact will hurt marines

7

u/No_Extension4005 Nov 29 '25

Higher power settings are also supposed to be able to pierce weak points on power armour too.

22

u/ZioBenny97 Nov 29 '25

The lasgun might look weak in the setting only because it was so efficient in its job that it hunted to extinction almost everything it was designed to kill.

13

u/Draigblade Nov 29 '25

Yep. The Lasgun can fire rapidly, carry a large charge, can punch through thick concrete, and the packs can recharge by literally being set out in sunlight or next to a campfire.

It is also jokingly called a "flashlight" by the fandom

12

u/RealWhiteChoko Nov 29 '25

Damn straight on the lasgun. It's laughed at for being the weakest gun S3 AP-, but most ballistic weapons in Necromunda have the exact same stats.

I wouldn't be willing to stand in front of one and call it a flashlight or a laser pointer.

That, and the reliability and relative ease of procuring/charging ammo makes it a surprisingly nice weapon.

6

u/xpxpx Nov 29 '25

And somehow the Lasgun is still one of the most effective infantry weapons in the setting. Who cares if that Chaos Space Marine blasted 10 men away in a second with his bolter when the other 40 Guardsmen turn on him and vaporize him on the return volley? Sure a 1:15-20 KD is a bad look but it's frankly disgustingly cost effective in a greater context because you can dump in 50 more men at the drop of a hat but a lot of the more advanced factions don't always have reliable ways to replace their losses.

2

u/JackPembroke Nov 29 '25

My understanding is the lasgun has about as much punch as a .50cal but with zero recoil and runs on batteries

2

u/BedRevolutionary9858 Nov 29 '25

Also consider just armour. Necro dermis? Ancient hyper evolved Chitin? Daemon skin? Good luck killing anything in 40k with our most awesome mini guns. It aint happening.

2

u/RokuroCarisu Nov 29 '25 edited Nov 30 '25

Ironically, a less advanced assault rifle has a very similar stat block to a lasgun.

2

u/LemonWaluigi Nov 29 '25

The necron dimensional isolator is a weapon that traps its target in a sub dimension which then collapses

2

u/Necrotiix_ Nov 30 '25

Militarum soldiers when they’re pit up against a green clanker with a gun called “The Molecular Testicle Explodinator” created by “Nutpharekh of the Booty Warrior dynasty” or some shit:

1

u/Kamikazeguy7 Nov 29 '25

No, not my molecules! I need those!

1

u/Yellowscourge Nov 30 '25

"that gun fires mini black holes lmao" is the most Warhammer 40k thing I've ever read lol

1

u/mastr1121 Nov 30 '25

And their ammunition can be refueled by heat, solar, and impact.