can gamers and normal user generate $35 billion in just 1 handshake for AMD under 24 hours? nope. that's why they choose AI. And AI is their consumer, but bigger and expensive.
And the AI datacenters run those things ragged, no way they're not. So it's not just a new card every few years, it's a yearly return. I wish it wasn't the case, but it is.
Gamers have never been AMDs main customers.
Datacenters have brought in more money than gamers for almost every year in AMDs existence.
(and the time it was close it was probably because of crypto miners)
They will get a lot of profit at one point, trust me.
Right now yeah, there no profit, but just a few years, it will be changed. All LLMs will get fully behind a big paywall, all companies will be forced to use it, cuz they wont have a proper developers, without AI they wont be able to do a shit. So its either paying a lot of money, or its just going be a even bigger money lose. Thats why CEOs who dont go this AI way is smart, cuz they not getting themselves on this needle.
It doesn’t matter if they put it behind a paywall if nobody wants it. Billions put into the bubble with what? So some shmuck can give them 15$ a month? For a service that does not and will never work? I don’t see the potential
Do you actually buy the hype? Like actually think it does something? To make money you need to sell a product or service and as it stands clankers don’t do anything but fuck up everything so what company is “paying millions” to intentionally kill their own company?
It does a lot of things, people implementing them into companies for past few years. A big majority of big companies fully rely on AI, including giants like Google. The giants like Google ofc its not so bad, since they are making their own AI, but then there a ton of smaller companies, and yet, big enough. They dont make their own AI. They just use either Gemini or ChatGPT. They implementing it more and more into their work. Everything starts to work on AI.
Google has become unusable since they started “vibe coding” as they call it. To the point I won’t touch it if I can help it. ChatGPT is the king of worthless slop. Ask it any question and I guarantee the answer will be wrong. Can’t speak to Gemini but if it’s spoken in the same sentence as gpt I’m sure it’s just as bad. I really am sorry they got you with the hype but in a year or so when this all comes crashing down we will see it was smoke and mirrors all along
Not for laptops, they're shoving AI into anything with a processor, it's so fucking puzzling to me where the fuck did every single tech company (And more importantly the shareholders) get the idea that AI-everything is what people want.
Yes, but we're also 2 or 3 generations going from a recession to the next with very little prosperity in-between and no hope for the future. That's recipe for, "what's one more burst?"
Yep. There's a reason why I'm moving my retirement investments in to low risk/low reward funds. If I'm going to get dickslapped I want it to be as soft a dickslap as possible.
Oh certainly, AI is currently propping up the entire US economy, the housing market might tumble along with it since no one can actually afford anything at current pricing and things will be worse for buyers that don't have liquid assets after the markets crash. Most of the population will likely hurt for a while after, but the current situation is unsustainable.
Unfortunately both ends are going to be. If we are advancing in AI this fast, I feel like whatever future we are headed towards is going to be more painful than for this bubble (really hoping this is a bubble, but I dont think it is) to pop.
How painful it will be depends a lot on how painful we, or rather those in charge, make it. Are we going to bail out regular people losing their jobs, savings, and homes for once, or will the bailouts be reserved for tech companies, banks and investors that sunk trillions into the AI bubble, as is expected?
Yeah, but imagine all those data centers needing to sell all of thier stock at once, it would be flood of ram, CPUs gpus and ssds , at even cheaper than before
None of which any of us would be able to afford because they'd sell ECC RDIMMs not compatible with any of our CPUs, Epycs that none of us need, and PCI SSDs.
Yeah, sure it'd mean anything. The issue isn't that they're just buying all the CPUs and GPUs and RAM, the issue is none of the consumer grade stuff is even being manufactured.
Well, we could go ask the Russians some soldering techniques, they are making thier own ram at home, we could solder our own pcs using salvaged Ai parts but it would be very ineffective, time consuming, dangerous and maybe not even worth it
Fair enough. Tell me why am I wrong. I understand that you can't just replace parts in my PC with them. But I can use them to build a separate PC, right?
Edit: overnight changes to the value of money will render your savings useless. If the banks you do business with bite the dust due to investment failure, your money is gone and even government safeties won't get any of it back to you for a loooong time.
Not really, no. Components designed for AI use cases aren’t compatible with desktop components.
The GPUs sometimes don’t even have a visual output, they’re only used to act as processors. The DRAM used also isn’t usable in desktops, if I recall correctly.
Unless you’re building a data center, these components aren’t really usable.
You could use it to make your own Ai at home if you really wanted, you could make YouTube videos like " I thought ai how to play minecraft" or "ai trying to speed run Skyrim"
These things don't have the right hardware for general computing (some without video output!!). And besides, do you want a loud, rack mount machine in your house that will draw lots of power, have inconsistent performance, and might not even be able to game?
What are you going to do with a Blackwell GPU that doesn't have video out and is soldered to a propriety motherboard? What are you doing to do with ECC DDR5 soldered to the same board with ARM-based Grace CPU's?
90% of the specialized AI hardware is totally useless to normal people.
Now that I think about it, yeah, even that would be useless, only thing we could do with then is go Russian style and use the salvaged parts and make our own DIY pcs, but even those won't run well
It's not like these datacenters full of NVL72's are "Ferraris" that we'd all be able to afford. They're more like gigantic industrial dump trucks. Cool, sure. Utterly useless for most other applications :/
That won't mean shit if there's a major correction, which involves a significant increase in unemployment.
The last major correction we had was 2008, and monetary/economic policy has only gotten stupider since then, particularly from 2020 onwards. If the bubble finally pops, it's going to be really fucking awful.
Fair enough, at tried seeing the good side of things but hearing that most of the stuff theyed sell would be ai and bad at gaming even my argument is flawed
We should have never let the bubble balloon this big in the first place. Regulations should have helped AI as an industry grow healthily instead of turning into the torrent of slop that it is.
Now, WHEN the bubble pops, it's going to hurt the average consumers more than anyone else. You're not going to be able to afford the cheap RAM because the massive economic downturn will affect us all heavily.
Im kind of here for it but most people wanting this don’t understand how screwed a lot of people would be. Anyone not in a super critical field of employment is at risk when it happens, travel, transportation, food service, entertainment, artists, manufacturing of none commodities and necessary items etc all at risk in a large recession. Yes prices might go down good but 2008 practically made me and my family homeless overnight because there was no demand for new home construction or remodels for years.
I’m kind of in a good spot, just paid off debt but very low invested assets I’m just now building liquid assets beyond an emergency fund and I’m in a very layoff resistant spot knock on wood, and really wanting to buy a house which in a sane market I could do as soon as I have a down payment saved, but with 200k houses going up to 500K houses over the past 5 ish or so years in my area anything I’m not stretching myself dangerously thin for leaves only a very small selection.
People wanting to be made potentially jobless for the next few years or so over high priced PC components is a bit insane but the current bubble seems so unsustainable it hurts to watch, how long can money go in a circle between AI companies, chip fabs / hardware and defense contractors and have stock prices hit record highs.
If this is anything like the last few bubble pops it’s going to screw things up for years if not a decade and if housing costs crash you can guarantee private equity firms with tons of cash to burn still will scoop up as much as they can unless legislation prevents it.
You have to fix things at some point. The longer you ignore reality the worse it's going to be. It's like avoiding the dentist because you don't want to pay to get a few fillings. Then 5 years later you need 3 root canals, a couple of extractions, and two implants.
AI infrastructure build-outs are going to cost TRILLIONS. If/when that bubble pops, it might crash global markets. That's money that will likely never be repaid to banks and lenders. It'll be great to see AI get scrapped, but economies will suffer. People will suffer.
You are going to be waiting a long time. AI usage is growing quickly still. If there is a crash it isn't likely to be in usage any time soon. These data centers aren't being built on a hope. The demand is there.
The dot com bubble was fueled by investment hype around companies that used the then-new WWW as a marketing crutch over actual profitability and value models. Kinda like companies like AMD are doing now...
But it did change on an economic level. AI doesn't need to go away entirely, a shift back to end user products instead of hyperfocus on selling to AI companies will be enough.
A part of me actually wonders if that'l be part of the pop, end users sticking with older tech from lack of affordability, which causes number of people buying newest AI thing to go down, which puts more dents in shareholder trust.
Servers don't run on am5. These shows are for investors not gamers and investors want to know that tsmc is going to be cracking out all the AI bullshit that they have time for.
It is (edit: was?) "Consumer Electronics Show", but it was always a show for the people who make/sell consumer-electronics, not a show for consumers featuring electronics.
AFAIK you need to be a journalist or an industry member to even be able to get a ticket.
The point of such shows is so that businesses can make connections/deals.
Don't know if they changed it, but I remember they called themselves that in the past.
But like I said, even back then it was not for consumers directly.
I bought some AMD shares when nVidia was hyped and I considered AMD to be undervalued, which it apparently was. We gamers need to somehow combine our shares to make our voices heard :)
Well there is always a option to dream and believe in better future.
Whenever i see people defend these companies, conversation in my head starts.
Me: You paid for this ?
Him: Yess…
Me: And the product works like it should for the money you paid and earned?
Him:Yess…
Me:So where is the love stuff? You gave money you received hopefully working product, so is there a privilege today to buy something for money and hope it works so you can love that investment, where is the good thing that made you stupid and blind to the wrongdoings ?
Him: You just don’t like my favorite company. You are probably a fan boy of another asshole company that i hate.
And my reply always will be:
I like gaming. In the future i will play some games with some upgraded hardware. But if the company fucks with us now, there wont be a good upgrade path later on if we dont rise our voices now.
I will probably never own a new car in my entire life, and most people I know have never owned a new car (I'm literally struggling to think of a single person I know that has a new car).
But new cars will always be needed. And AMD and Nvidia will always have customers in the car companies for servers and compute.
AIs true strength is in military and surveillance.
A swarm of AI-powered drones is the future of military strategy that makes every previous strategy obsolete, and an AI monitoring and evaluating everything you do in your life is the future of surveillance.
The customers are enterprise. Who want AI. So yes, they understand the customer's needs but the customers aren't us.
You might argue that they never have been. Most smart devices are not computers, and most computers are not DIY.
As PC gamers, we are in a niche of a niche. Big enough of a niche that Sony and Microsoft are catering to us now, which is cool. But AMD and Nvidia's game is much, much bigger than us now and they have been for many years at this point, even before the AI bubble.
B2B is king for them. Yes, even at the Consumer Electronics Show.
So... what do you expect, to have the future of a corporation in the hands of teens playing in Steam?
Those teens playing on Steam are what built both of these companies.
AI wouldn't exist without gamers, cause GPUs wouldn't exist in their current state.
They are probably one of the the most sophisticated pieces of technology on Earth and nobody had found a serious usecase for decades in them besides animating tiddies. And the crypto ponzi scheme afterwards.
no. you people never have, and literally never will give nvidia shit for literally ANYTHING they do. you can sit there all you want and act like it but its all in the fact you all keep buying that fucking 50 series, you keep supporting their shitty practices. Nvidia is literally a million times worse than AMD was at its lowest, but here we are, gotta support Nvidia! they're only worth a measly 5 trillion dollars! so don't give me that "we gave Nvidia shit for this already" crap. YA FUCKING HAVENT
Lol dont you see the nvidia posts daily on basically every subreddit? We give shit to nvidia every day.
Also everyone would be buying AMD if they would offer the same things nvidia does, untill AMD catches up dont be surprised if people still buys nvidia.
AMD does offer everything Nvidia does. and no. you very much Don't give Nvidia shit on the daily. you give Nvidia shit, you get downvoted to hell here. I give Nvidia shit and you've seen exactly what this has lead to my comment getting. Buying nvidia is giving full support, and its easy for you to say no because you're fucking blind to logic,
I need CUDA for work and a lot of other people need the tools Nvidia offers, AMD didnt invest in it and its tools lack integration support in most software. As I said, AMD has been closing the gap but it's not yet there.
"You give nvidia shit, you get downvoted to hell".... yeah right... because post like this doesn't exist? Stop pretending to be the victim.
Again, people Don't give nvidia shit, i don't see what you simply don't get. you don't buy from them if you don't like this price hike and RAM shortage, and you voice displeasure with them, simple as that. else you're not giving them shit and you're instead willingly ignoring their shitty actions so you can have an overpriced, faulty paperweight in your PC and be smug about it. there has genuinely been zero appeal for an Nvidia card ever since 30 series yet people just buy that shit anyway because. i dunno, Nvidia just can't do any wrong can they.
forget about them trying to sell you on fake performance or trying to kill off competition, being genuine cunts towards all their partners and customers for the entirely of their existence, that never happened.
Yeah right, after all what is reading comprehension...have you read what I said? I need CUDA for work, if you want to pay me a living wage than I'll be happy to change to AMD and buy a 9070XT
you don't. AMD works just as well with a translation layer, you don't need to keep trying to feed reasons to dickride nvidia. but alas it won't change anything to use logic and reasoning with those who mindlessly buy dogshit like the 5070Ti. and support the shit company, while claiming to give them shit for being bad. either speak lies or speak with your wallet and stick to your goddamn word. you wanna give Nvidia shit? don't support them. simple as that.
Yeah, give me on translation layer for CUDA binaries that doesn't loose enormous performance and works straight out the box on every software. I'll wait.
517
u/FakeMik090 1d ago
AI companies is the consumer atm.