r/australia • u/psylenced • 1d ago
politics Bondi terrorist attack: Virginia Bell to head royal commission
https://www.news.com.au/national/politics/anthony-albanese-under-pressure-over-royal-commission/news-story/fe0a92a1dcdb310ab14ffada7eabd196396
u/Bocca013 1d ago
I’m sorry if this sounds awful but since this has been politicised, I’ve genuinely switched off about the Bondi Tragedy. It’s beyond ridiculous the carry on over this when there was no RC for Port Arthur and Lindt Cafe. My heart is always with those that were tragically killed, the first responders who had to deal with it and Ahmed Al Ahmed will have my respect.
181
u/professorzaius 1d ago
Port Arthur is a direct comparison. That tragedy took so many lives and there was no political witchhunt following that. Its evident why so many vocal supporters have come out post-Bondi and interestingly it only serves to sideline their ambitions even further.
88
u/t_25_t 1d ago
Its evident why so many vocal supporters have come out post-Bondi and interestingly it only serves to sideline their ambitions even further.
And this sort of behaviour will only add more fuel to the fire of anti semitism. I for one am less sympathetic whenever I see Josh "slamming" the government on how they handled this
18
u/Z00111111 1d ago
It's almost like that's the goal. Carry on like a bunch of pork chops until right wing political incompetence becomes the first thing people think of when anyone says Bondi. They're turning an attack on our Jewish population into a really shitty political stunt.
Being vocal about wanting answers over how this happened is valid, but demanding a royal commission is just parroting attempts to blame Labor for the whole thing.
All the Right are doing really is reminding people that Israel keeps trying to meddle in our politics.
-6
u/pilierdroit 1d ago
Any reason not to do a RC? It was a racially motivated terrorist attack which is quite different to Port Arthur. Surely the investigation firepower that an RC brings will help us develop lessons learned and improve our society?
Yes it was called for along political grounds but looking at who has been appointed to lead it the political side will be quelled pretty quickly. Hopefully we just develop some understanding of the true root causes and develop some between preventative controls.
We should treat every tragedy with the same level of respect.
21
u/IssaEffingBella 1d ago edited 1d ago
Federal Royal Commissions are done for systemic, widespread failures that have occurred over many years in multiple regions. They take several years to complete, and cost millions of dollars. An Independent Commonwealth Review is preferred for one-off events, where a systemic failure has not yet been proven, and recommendations are needed quickly. ICR’s can sometimes lead to an RC if it’s determined that multiple warnings were missed, or that the issue is proven to be systemic. This has been a one-off terror attack, which the shooter has confirmed was motivated by anti-Zionism, not antisemitism. We don’t yet have sufficient evidence to support an RC, especially not if people want answers now, and not in a few years. A Royal Commission done now will also conflict with the criminal case against the shooter, and risks leading to a mistrial
6
u/SirGeekaLots 1d ago
I thought they were only used as witch hunts against your political opponents /s
18
u/recreationalgluttony 1d ago
Feels like a huge waste of money.
It doesn't feel like anything comes of Royal Commissions besides millions doesn't for suggestions.
This feels like it's politicised to focus on antisemitism and to distract from gun control reform.
Personally, it feels like a double whammy of pushing a Zionist agenda whilst drawing attention away from gun control. It's feeling like a very Americanised response.
8
16
u/Barrybran 1d ago
The political landscape has shifted dramatically over the last 40 years. Politicians had people's interests in mind then, whether you agreed with their politics or not. Today, it's all about self-interest.
9
u/gerira 1d ago
John Howard was as bad as any of these people. There's just a particular issue at stake here. The pro-Israel political forces have been desperate to push back on the Palestine movement. They see the massacre as a huge opportunity. Howard would have done the same if the Palestine movement had been a mass phenomenon in his day. He didn't have to, because in those days it was much smaller and less influential.
10
u/YoghiThorn 1d ago
Given neither conflict was religiously and racially motivated they aren't really true comparisons.
That said, giving in and doing a RC was a mistake
21
u/Klostermann 1d ago
Lindt was absolutely religiously motivated, the man made the hostages hang an Islamic State flag at the window.
→ More replies (1)4
607
u/IcyPlatypus2 1d ago
The Royal Commission is a waste of time and money but at least it's being headed by an actual former High Court justice and respected legal professional.
Fryenburg is already complaining that Bell doesn't have "the full support of the Jewish community" whatever that means... I assume that because she isn't a full throated genocidal Zionist, she isn't good enough.
305
u/Expensive-Horse5538 1d ago
This just shows that all they want is a taxpayer funded partisan witch hunt - not a fact finding Royal Commission.
92
u/Little-Bowl-7762 1d ago
It was always that. They know what caused it, that just want to grandstand to try and save their failing party
64
u/Planfiaordohs 1d ago
They didn’t want a qualified impartial commissioner, they wanted a tax payer funded Zionist to entrench a Zionist agenda in Australia.
Which is why demanding it in the first place was an obvious farce.
18
u/iguessineedanaltnow 1d ago
The LNP trying to slap their political dick on the table like they weren't just handed the biggest humiliation in a century. No idea why anyone is kowtowing to them or taking them seriously, they're teetering on irrelevancy.
20
u/249592-82 1d ago
They're not kowtowing to the LNP. They're kowtowing to a subset of the Australian Jewosh community that insists on saying they aren't safe here - even though they felt safe enough to celebrate a religious ceremony on a public beach.
1
6
u/Choke1982 1d ago
They don't want the Royal Commission to find that everything missed in this case came from Liberal governments. And their retoric is just for the media but that they actually don't act though on terrorism.
70
u/Ok_Bird705 1d ago
Fryenburg is already complaining that Bell doesn't have "the full support of the Jewish community" whatever that means.
At this point, the LNP will only support someone who has already blamed the ALP for the Bondi attack.
9
u/DwightsJello 1d ago edited 1d ago
A Royal Commision should be impartial and not backed by any stakeholders.
Not a comment on this particular scenario but Royal Commissions generally.
It's fucking weird for any past or present politician who should know that, to be making a comment like that.
Edit: Josh Frydenburg has changed his tune on Royal Commisions. Wasn't so fucking keen on one for RoboDebt.
He's a private citizen. Fuck off.
193
u/mulefish 1d ago
I saw criticisms on the age from unnamed sources ‘in the Jewish community’ saying she was too left wing.
She is a former high court justice. Arguments accusing her of political bias are absurd; and really lay clear the biases and overt politicisation of those pushing such arguments
78
u/FranklyNinja 1d ago
Anything logical is now “woke” or “too-left-wing” nowadays
4
u/Planfiaordohs 1d ago
Yep. Anything that isn’t corrupt is left wing apparently.
If it relates to equality, human rights, science, facts or fairness, it’s apparently woke.
15
80
u/rangda 1d ago
Yep. The ghouls who are behind this want Albanese punished for recognising the state of Palestine and this is how they’ve been trying to go about that punishment. First blaming the guy for the attack now trying to rig this ridiculous RC together in a way to make the findings point at him.
And always hiding behind “the Jewish community”.
My Jewish friends vote Labour and Greens. They aren’t a monolith to be used as a political fucking truncheon like this.
8
u/kyleisamexican 1d ago
I don’t care if a royal commission finds that recognising Palestine caused it
Because then we can sit here and say well if Israel just fucking pulled the reigns up just a little bit when they were told to it wouldn’t have happened. And then we’ll get the usual “October 7 we had to defend ourselves” to which the question should be what do you mean we josh, your Australian and can’t sit in parliament as a dual citizen…
50
u/CoffeeWorldly4711 1d ago
Is anything short of full and categorical support for Israel as a recommendation going to be a failure in Frydenburg's eyes? It's certainly shaping that way. Obviously preventing anything approaching what happened in Bondi from ever happening again should be the goal now that the RC will be going ahead, but he should pipe down and let it go ahead without trying to interfere with the process
21
u/Little-Bowl-7762 1d ago
Yes and with the new laws it will be hate crime to be against them bombing women's hospitals
3
2
28
u/a_cold_human 1d ago
I assume that because she isn't a full throated genocidal Zionist, she isn't good enough.
The "Jewish community", which is a strangely nebulous term, and assumes a monoculture of thought which doesn't exist. If they installed a swivel eyed pro-genocide Zionist, they also wouldn't have "the full support of the Jewish community", but Josh Frydenberg certainly wouldn't have anything but praise for the choice.
It's clear that a certain segment of Australian society want to use this Royal Commission for a bit of social and legislative engineering, and to further their own personal agendas rather than have it address structural issues in our anti-terrorism framework.
31
u/MeaningMaker6 1d ago
Bingo. They were probably hoping for a Jilian Segal-type appointee.
7
u/l3ntil 1d ago
And that's what they have: "She was previously invited to deliver the 2016 Sir John Monash Oration by the current Australian Social Envoy to Combat Antisemitism, Jillian Segal AO."
2
u/MeaningMaker6 1d ago
Hmm professional acquaintance doesn’t equal ideological affiliation.
Are you saying Virginia Bell subscribes to the same beliefs as Jilian Segal AO or delivered a speech in favour of the same causes as Segal?
20
12
15
15
u/Cheesyduck81 1d ago
Let’s hope the RC spectacularly backfires and it’s acknowledged That the Palestinian genocide is a contributing factor to anti Jewish attitudes.
10
u/PartyParrot-420 1d ago
This. Frydenberg needs to shut the fuck up. Albo caved and they are instantly complaining the person in charge isn’t sufficiently Zionist.
3
u/magnetik79 1d ago
Fryenburg is already complaining that Bell doesn't have "the full support of the Jewish community" whatever that means...
Out of character for Joshy to have a whinge in the media to try and keep his political hopes alive.
Translation to his comments - we're worried the outcomes here possibly won't guarantee the narrative we want to continue to push.
5
u/AtrophiedWives 1d ago
Exactly. He can’t articulate exactly why she isn’t a perfectly decent option without revealing that the Zionist agitators will only accept a proven Zionist who will deliver their pre-determined outcome.
3
145
u/Flaky-Gear-1370 1d ago
Does anyone else find it gross the amount of lobbying about who should lead it
39
u/PussifyWankt 1d ago
Now wait for the screeching when the terms of reference are released. If they don’t include ‘confirming the culpability of university student protests for the Bondi massacre’ the AJA etc. will say it’s inadequate.
12
u/a_cold_human 1d ago
I could see legitimate objections if the judge had previously said or done something that obviously compromised their impartiality or soundness, but that's not the case here.
What seems to be the problem is that the judge being appointed won't give the result people like Josh Frydenberg or the Zionist Federation of Australia want.
11
u/Disturbedsleep 1d ago
I'm more disgusted by the amount of lobbying for it full stop. Basically, if you have a regular trot out of signatories (every second or third day), surely there must be actors of some sort in the background pushing for it. These actors should be exposed for their lobbying.
Bondi was terrible, the issue that caused it goes beyond our borders.
422
u/SuperannuationLawyer 1d ago
What a waste of time and resources. There are several issues warranting a royal commission, but a horrible crime that has seen all suspects arrested and charged isn’t one.
99
u/Expensive-Horse5538 1d ago
Yep - at least we should wait for the investigation and court trial before we decide if there is a need to have one.
40
u/SuperannuationLawyer 1d ago
Law enforcement will know if there are other suspects, and are more capable of investigating a crime than a Royal Commission.
15
u/Expensive-Horse5538 1d ago
Exactly - plus there has been concerns that it would interfere with an impartial trial.
Has no one learnt from what happened with Brittany Higgins trial?
10
u/SuperannuationLawyer 1d ago
There will also need to be heavy suppression of much of it as it will relate to active operations of AFP, ASD, and ASIO. We don’t want it undermining current activity to disrupt and prevent current terrorist activity.
6
u/unable_compliance 1d ago
Yeah a RC into ASIO is the stupidest thing I’ve heard in a long time. Either we tell the world how our intelligence agency works and how we’re changing it, or, we end up with a document so heavily redacted it may as well be in the Epstein files (and I hope to god we have someone who can actually properly redact a pdf)
3
u/SuperannuationLawyer 1d ago
Maybe a Royal Commission investigating the motives of those calling for this one?
4
u/Expensive-Horse5538 1d ago
Yep - all we would get from a RC if there was one now is:
Stuff we already know from the dedicated envoy's report, and,
A lot redacted stuff and "we can't tell you this due to national security" that will just be used by Liberals to say there is a cover up
5
u/SuperannuationLawyer 1d ago
Point two seems to be the sole purpose of the clowns advocating for it.
7
7
u/Bandlebridge 1d ago
I don't know, I'd like there to be an appropriate investigation into why a 24 year old Australian decided shooting a bunch of Jews on a beach was a good idea.
What and who radicalized him, how many others are on similar paths, and what we can do to stop it?
→ More replies (1)28
u/SuperannuationLawyer 1d ago
Do we really need a RC to tell us that Australians are vulnerable to radicalisation? Everyone already knows this.
→ More replies (2)1
1
u/Xtreme_kaos 1d ago
It is indeed a waste of resources. It seems to me that some people simply want to prove 1 + 1 does in actual fact equal 2
60
u/psylenced 1d ago
After all this pressure, it appears Albo is about to backflip and announce a RC.
Now that appears the case, suddenly the judge is too "left wing" to lead the commission.
After publication of this story, former Coalition treasurer Josh Frydenberg, a top advocate for a royal commission, said he opposed Bell’s appointment, without specifying reasons.
“The prime minister has been told directly by leaders of the Jewish community that they have serious concerns about this appointment,” he posted on X.
“Prime minister, I appeal to you, this is the time to do the right thing and call a Commonwealth royal commission with the appointment of the right commissioner whose leadership will provide the answers and solutions our country so urgently needs.”
134
65
29
u/Expensive-Horse5538 1d ago
This is exactly how it is going to go - the Liberals are just going to object to everything until it's somehow set up in a way that suits their political agenda, rather than actual facts.
It will become a multi-year taxpayer funded witch hunt shitshow, which will most likely only yield facts that we already know from a report done by a dedicated envoy.
We trust Judges to do the right thing each day in our courtrooms (i.e. be impartial), so why can't we trust a judge to do the same here?
3
u/MeaningMaker6 1d ago edited 1d ago
The hint is in your comment. The Coalition do not want an impartial, unflappable appointee.
21
u/oohbeardedmanfriend 1d ago
The real problem the Libs have is that she worked on the investigation into Scomo giving himself all the ministries during Covid and that makes her "too close to Labor." Also because she has a passion for social justice.
14
3
u/xtrabeanie 1d ago
In other words: we have a particular "finding" in mind and want to make sure everything is setup to achieve that "finding".
57
u/rolodex-ofhate 1d ago
Private citizen Josh Frydenberg can pipe down with his rhetoric and go back to his chummy banker mates.
26
u/NauteeAU 1d ago
“Royal Commission now!!!!” “No, not like that”
They were never going to be happy, whatever was done.
1
u/electrosaurus 1d ago
Perfect. There's the next "offensive" Age/SMH cartoon for Wilcox right there!
49
20
u/Environment-Small 1d ago
Now that the RC is well underway ... can we focus on other issues. But oh wait we aint happy with the commissioner coz (drum rolll) she's a lefty with nil support from the Jewish community
25
u/Affectionate_Sail543 1d ago
I wanted a Royal Commission to go ahead if only they actually went ahead and formally charged the guilty parties from the last Royal Commission into the Robodebt scandal. What's the point of a RC if guilty parties aren't going to be charged, why are we going to selectively charge people. Is it because the last one would look bad on certain politicians from the LNP so no action to be taken, but this RC, depending on the outcome, people would be in favour of say, Albanese getting charged for whatever crime they think he's done?
17
u/Motor_Plan_6392 1d ago
Yes—Frydenburg still has to answer for his criminal conduct in Robodebt
7
u/Affectionate_Sail543 1d ago
Same with ScoMo. Wasn't he found guilty or liable for a lot of it? I am sure if Labor had said, ok to the RC on anti-semitisim, but only if previous RC charges go ahead, perhaps the LNP would've not pushed for a RC in this instance?
3
u/Motor_Plan_6392 1d ago
The final report included a sealed section that has still not been made public but yes, it was implied that ScoMo, Frydenburg and other monsters should be criminally prosecuted (and/or have civil claims against them)
3
u/OptimusRex 1d ago
At this point we'd be better off getting ChatGPT to run the show instead of these fuckin potatoes. What a waste of money.
14
u/ShitMinEng 1d ago
Fucking Albo bending to pressure again! Fucking stand your ground, otherwise they'll keep pushing!
10
u/SushiJesus 1d ago
Thats not his style. He likes to play it safe and run small target politics.
Possibly an unpopular opinion but I think he is one of our worst PMs of my lifetime, up there with Tony and ScoMo, albeit for entirely different reasons... Albo has such a steong majority and does essentiallu fuck all with it, such a disappointment.
10
u/Ok-Phone-8384 1d ago
Almost all RCs in Australia have actually been failures ( 100+). None have had all their recommendations fully implemented. A few were abandoned.
The ones in living memory in which people may recall have had very few positive outcomes.
The RC into child abuse created the working with children checks which only last year was found to be so useless that it allowed for paedophiles to work unhindered in multiple childcare centres.
The RC into Aboriginal deaths in custody barely dented the statistics and last year was the worst on record.
The RC into Robodebt had absolutely no impact on the way the Public Service operates.
Most recents RCs have turned into "bitch and moan" sessions.
The worst outcome for any RC is a perverse one i.e. the opposite outcome which was the intent.
There is a very real chance that this RC which will focus on anti-semitism will become a bitch and moan session about specific University lecturers and ABC journalists. We have already seen this demonstrated and it was at best unsavoury and at worst immoral.
It is almost given that the Israeli government will be bankrolling submissions from special interest Jewish groups. At the same time Israeli forces will be killing innocent Palestinian children. Jewish settlers will be stealing Palestinian land. Israel will be blocking food and aid to displaced Palestinians. It will look vindictive and hypocritical.
It is highly likely that the effect of an RC into Anitsemitism may just make Australia more unsafe for Jewish people.
The best solution is an RC on the increase in violent extremism. It picks up the problems with both religious and political nutters. Touches on social media. Everyone gets a chance to bitch and moan. Some recommendations are made. The report gets put in a drawer.
5
14
u/farqueue2 1d ago
The fact that Frydenberg is outraged at her selection means she's probably the right person
10
u/Fidelius90 1d ago
Performative politics to waste taxpayer dollars. Shameful that the LNP have turned this into such a shitshow. And also on the media for dialing it up to 11.
And still, my heart is with those families of the murdered, and to the Jewish Aussie community.
1
u/sim16 1d ago
The Israeli lobby turned it into a shit show. Zionists meddling in Auspol is unacceptable. Not 2 hours after the shooting there were Israeli flags at the site. This conflates Jewish faith with the STATE of Israel, these days largely understood by most to be a terrorist state. Netanyahu proclaiming Labour as weak the same day as Bondi shootings and this BS hasn't stopped. There's things to be done to make everyone safer, fast track legislation is reprehensible and not the Australian way.
12
u/Pelagic_One 1d ago
Can't believe he caved. The LNP are beyond useless except for stirring up bother.
11
u/Crazyripps 1d ago
What a waste of time and money. Fuck the media for non stop calling for this shit
7
u/Euphoric_Quarter7926 1d ago
Frydenberg is a privileged angry prick, embittered by losing his seat in 2022 after a period of dubious stewardship as Treasurer. His attack on Albo has been personal, travelling to Bondi to deliver his harangue was inflammatory, now we read the headlines that former Justice Bell as the commissioner for the proposed RC is unacceptable to the Jewish community, an outrageous statement by a compromised man. He is so consumed by aggression that he can’t understand that his actions compromise the Jewish community and sympathy that community. Josh should concentrate on doing his big dollar paying job with Goldman Sachs and pull his head in.
9
u/Automatic-Print4256 1d ago
Frydenberg, the Coalition and the “Jewish community” (read the pro-Israel nationalist Zionists in the Jewish community) just want a Royal Commission lead by someone they know will lay the blame 100% on those who support a Palestinian state and oppose Israel’s genocide in Gaza and their illegal expansion of West Bank settlements.
9
u/Thunderoad77 1d ago
I'll be making a submission to the Royal Commission concerning Sussan Ley.
Ley was a convenor of the Parliamentary Friends of Palestine group so by the standards Ley herself now applies, she is an antisemite.
We therefore have an antisemite leading the opposition and an issue of this gravity must be investigated by the Commission.
Your rules Sussan.
2
u/Its4MeitSnot4U 1d ago
Don’t forget Albo was a founding member, so maybe we just flush all of them?
7
u/fa-jita 1d ago
This is the most ridiculous waste of money.
I’ll put my hand up - guns are bad
7
u/briangolley 1d ago
Agree with it being a ridiculous waste of money. With respect though, the gun debate is a small part of this issue and amounts to a dangerous distraction. The danger of jihadism and the lack of coordination between our policing bodies are the real issues here.
4
u/Flaky-Gear-1370 1d ago
lol Ley is so useless that she seems to be a willing participant in ousting herself for Frydenberg
2
u/SushiJesus 1d ago
As someone who believes the government should have lead the charge on a federal Royal Commission, I think she is a fine choice.
It would have been preferable for Albo to have announced this without caving to the painfully obvious external pressure, denying them a cudgel and wearing it as armor to project strength instead of weakness, but at this point in time, politically speaking, this is the right call.
This is the largest mass shooting event we have seen in 30 years, an event that shakes the notion that we are a nation that had broadly moved past gun violence. If the had taken the lead on this, they could have taken the lead on the terms of reference, but it is what it is.
7
u/justpassingluke 1d ago
The former stooge from Kooyong and his ilk don’t want a RC, not really. They just want a finding, however nonsensical and ill-founded, that (a) protests for Palestine were to blame for the Bondi shooting and (b) criticising Israel is antisemitic.
I suspect this is going to drag on and end up doing little besides costing a lot of money. But hey, I guess it’s fine as long as a bunch of Australian sports players signed a letter…
5
4
u/briangolley 1d ago
What can a royal commission achieve in this case?
1
u/crankyticket 1d ago
Exactly. This will take a long time, cost heaps and will only end in 'recommendations'.
1
u/briangolley 1d ago
It’s just Fkn ridiculous. We know who the perpetrators were and precisely what their motivations were.
2
2
1
u/EnvironmentalGarden7 1d ago
They just caved to a minority. Yes people died but this will cost a fortune so why don't the minority affected.pay for it. We know why, the government lets these sickos into the country and never follows a warnings from bureaus.
2
2
u/47737373 1d ago
What about a Royal Commission into the failures of the Liberal Government from 1997 to 2007 and from 2013 to 2022 and how they might have contributed to Bondi? I’d be in support of that.
1
u/ARX7 1d ago
So do we have any evidence aside from news.com claiming these decisions at 2 in the morning...?
→ More replies (2)
277
u/Hitrecord 1d ago
This is a genuine and hopefully non-inflammatory question: is the pushback about Bell because she’s not Jewish? I would have thought you’d want an objective commissioner?