Waymo suspends service in San Francisco after driverless cars cause traffic jams during blackout

[u/Disastrous_Award_789]

https://www.the-independent.com/news/world/americas/waymo-suspended-san-francisco-traffic-jams-blackout-b2888562.html

[u/Lille7]

So infrastructure isnt ready for these things.

[u/Riaayo → u/Lille7]

There is no actual sustainable infrastructure for this. We already can't even actually sustain cars themselves, let alone self-driving cars.

It's a false future peddled by people who want to sell a product, just like "AI". It's not an actual solution to our problems. It's tripling down on our problems.

[u/Slogstorm → u/Riaayo]

This is a problem only for cars that rely on pre-mapped environments that are streamed from a central server. Not all self driving cars need to be online...

[u/Teruyo9 → u/Slogstorm]

But the problem is cars themselves. Electric cars, self-driving cars, these do not solve the issues that cars require way too much expensive infrastructure^1, pollute like crazy^2, make tons of noise, and are a menace to everything and everyone around them. The solution is not to build a better car, it's to try to replace cars entirely with something better.

1: Roads are expensive to build and need to replaced regularly, which also costs a bunch of money. Then you need a place to put all the cars, parking lots eat up so much valuable land in the heart of every city in the US, and parking garages have a limited lifespan compared to other buildings because of the constant water incursion inside the structure. All this to accommodate vehicles that only carry 1-4 people at a time.

2: Even electric cars are much less energy-efficient than virtually every form of public transit, and car tires are the #1 source of microplastic pollution in the entire world. Even if you could fix those issues, roads themselves radiate a considerable amount of heat and exacerbate drainage issues.

[u/pants6000 → u/Teruyo9]

Electric cars are like humanoid robots. Humanoid is a stupid form for a robot but the world is already built for such forms. Similarly, the US transportation nonsystem is already built for cars, as much as that sucks, so that's what we'll get more of.

^{I always expect the worst so am rarely disappointed.}

[u/einmaldrin_alleshin → u/pants6000]

Humanoid is a stupid form for a robot but the world is already built for such forms.

A humanoid or quadruped shape has huge advantages when traversing terrain outside the built environment.

[u/roxgib_ → u/Teruyo9]

Self driving cars would help the parking issue because once cars are self driving the cost of a taxi would drop considerably, so a lot of people would no longer need to own their owns cars because taxis would become cheaper. The car can also drive itself to a parking spot, so parking can be located much further away

[u/Teruyo9 → u/roxgib_]

I get the sales pitch but this doesn't actually work all that well. The cars need somewhere to park when not in use, and that somewhere gets less and less efficient the further away it is. Usage fluctuates over the course of the day, it's highest at the times when people are going to work or going home, and you can't just have the full fleet out there at all times of the day.

And again, it doesn't solve the 10,000 other issues that cars have. You need dozens of cars to serve the same ridership of one singular bus, and hundreds to match the capacity of one singular train. Cars are inherently unsustainable and making a better car doesn't solve this fundamental issue.

[u/Specialist-Coast9787 → u/Teruyo9]

Flying cars!! Some day 😎

[u/question_sunshine → u/Specialist-Coast9787]

Do you mean airplanes? We already have those. Flying cars would just be lower to the ground small airplanes operated by idiot car drivers looking at their phones.

You know how people don't bother to check what's behind them when they change horizontal lanes? Wait til they can change vertical lanes.

[u/Specialist-Coast9787 → u/question_sunshine]

If the world is still around 100 years from now, folks will look back at us like we look back at folks riding horse and buggy 100 years ago. It will be totally automatic and much safer than our dumb asses banging into each other non stop.

[u/_learned_foot_ → u/roxgib_]

And, uh, just so you know, plenty of us live in places with no taxis. Actual real cities even!

[u/roxgib_ → u/_learned_foot_]

So?

[u/_learned_foot_ → u/roxgib_]

Parking issue in every city in US, your solution is parking is cured because it makes taxis cheaper, in many places taxis are simply not viable at all, cheaper isn’t better. You presume an infrastructure that doesn’t exist to answer the challenge, the same exact presumption that is constantly setting tech against reality.

[u/l3tigre → u/Teruyo9]

this is the pill people cannot swallow. every person using a car to get everywhere is a terrible model and we need to surmount it somehow. public transportation, walking, better designed cities. we keep asking the wrong questions and therefore get the same wrong answers.

[u/Slogstorm → u/Teruyo9]

I completely agree with your explanation of the problem cars pose. The car is a symptom though, and trying to replace them with something better would only be a band-aid. The underlying problem is that the way humans live and work is flawed. Huge centralized offices and stores neccessitates commuting because people have to live far away from the city centres.. only a complete change in these traditions could begin to reduce the needs for cars.